Middle East. What is Thailand's foreign policy?

[Manfred Liebig]

The Jews need a state, their own state, a safe haven offering shelter and protection against racism and persecutions. The Austrian Zionist Dr Theodor Herzl was convinced that the Jews could get their state. In his book "Der Judenstaat" (The Jewish State) published in the year 1896, he wrote: "The Jews who wish for a State will have it. We shall live at last as free men onour own soil, and die peacefully in our own homes." - "Antagonism is essential to man's greatest efforts. But the Jews, once settled in their own State, would probably have no more enemies." This state should be established in Palestine. At the time Herzl was writing Palestine was part of the Osman Empire. According to British records the Jews living there amounted to only 24, 000 individuals, before the Zionist immigration began in 1882. After the desintegration of the Osman Empire during World War One Palestine was administered by the High Commissioner of the British Mandate for Palestine on behalf of the League of Nations (predecessor of the United Nations,UN). The task of the British was to prepare Palestine for independence. In order to get the Jewish state Herzl was even willing to make a deal with the Osman ruler: "If \\ ///// the Sultan were to give us Palestine, we would in return undertake to regulate the whole finances of Turkey". It is significant to note that when Herzl talks about Palestine, he does not mention people. He simply ignores the fact that Palestine was a populated territory, not an empty strip of land waiting for settlers. This strange absence of people in the land where the Jewish state was to be established continues throughout the book. Words like "Palestinian" or "Arab" are not part of his vocabulary. When Herzl talks about people, he talks about Jewish people; and when he talks about land, he talks about the "Promised Land", "the native land". This land is God's gift to His chosen people and belongs to them alone. The legitimation of the Zionist claim of exclusive rights to all of Palestine is based on religious fundamentalism with an inherent racist component. In the Jewish state there is no place for the Palestinians; this explains their total absence in Herzl's book. There is, however, an indirect reference to the Palestinians: "On their arrival the emigrants will be welcomed by our chief officials with due solemnity but without foolish exultation, for the Promised Land will not yet have been conquered (!)". But what should be the fate of the non-Jewish indigenous people? Herzl carefully avoids this topic. But other Zionists are very explicit. A term frequently used is "transfer". The Palestinians should be "transferred" from their homeland to other parts of the Arab world: "We cannot allow the Arabs to block so valuable a piece of historic reconstruction... And therefore we must gently persuade them to 'trek'. After all, they have all Arabia with its million square miles... 'To fold their tents' and 'silently steal away' is their proverbial habit: let them exemplify it now". (Israel Zwangwill) But what, if they refuse to do so? Well, then the land must be conquered (Herzl) and the people be forced to leave. This was done with great success during the 1948 / 49 war when 720,000 (UN estimates) Palestinians became refugees. Initially, Jewish immigration to Palestine met little opposition from the Palestinian Arabs. However, when Jewish immigration increased markedly, tensions and conflicts arose. The history of the relations between Jewish immigrants and Palestinians is a trail of violence and suffering. Attacks on Jewish settlements and massacres prompted Jewish underground organisations such as Irgun and Lehi to conduct their own campaigns of violence. Both groups were labelled as terrorist organisations by the British government. Wars involving neighbouring Arab countries should follow. The Zionist dream of a peaceful Jewish state without enemies became a nightmare, for Jews and Palestinians alike. Instead of a safe haven Israel has been a threatened state. Even walls cannot guarantee its security. Immigrants from far away places cannot build a state on other people's land and expect to live in peace ever after. From a historic perspective, the establishment of the state of Israel, at the expense of the Palestinians, led to one of the world's most intractable conflicts causing instability in the entire region. As the current events in Gaza indicate, there is no light at the end of the tunnel. MANFRED LIEBIG GERMANY

[stilljustbrowsing]

The world is mine and mine alone! What right do you have to be here?
Not really, just making a point! The sooner people can accept and live together respecting each others differences and cultures the better.
Either there is A divine right for ALL or there is not.
I consider a "Jealous god" to be not good for humanity as a whole, for there will always be differences of oppinion.
The sooner international borders are dropped, the sooner we can all live as "free men and WOMEN" on this little planet.
Religion is the bain of our society, it seeks control and subservience to something that is neither tangible or proven. (each to their own and I respect peoples rights to believe what they want, just don't try to push it on me!)
Bottom line? It is about time we as "intellegent" animals started to help each other.
Strange we have so many sophisticated weapons of singular or mass destruction, but appear to have so little aid for the needy. (even though we are aware of their plight)

[villager]

The world is mine and mine alone! What right do you have to be here?
Not really, just making a point! The sooner people can accept and live together respecting each others differences and cultures the better.
Either there is A divine right for ALL or there is not.
I consider a "Jealous god" to be not good for humanity as a whole, for there will always be differences of oppinion.
The sooner international borders are dropped, the sooner we can all live as "free men and WOMEN" on this little planet.
Religion is the bain of our society, it seeks control and subservience to something that is neither tangible or proven. (each to their own and I respect peoples rights to believe what they want, just don't try to push it on me!)
Bottom line? It is about time we as "intellegent" animals started to help each other.
Strange we have so many sophisticated weapons of singular or mass destruction, but appear to have so little aid for the needy. (even though we are aware of their plight)

Hi SJB, having read the "HAMAS CHARTER"over 2 years ago i deduced then that there would never be genuine peace between the Israelis and Hamas , and if you look at the broad picture now Hamas and Fattah and are further apart than ever, and with Iran and to a lesser degree Syria both ARMING AND FINANCING Hamas to fight a proxy war against against Israel my thought for a lasting peace of any description is far from optimistic.

[stilljustbrowsing]

Hi villager, I think I know what you mean?
To ensure peace, be ready for war (not my original comment, I juststillrememberit)
Sometimes I think "genocide" is the only way, but then, what would that make me?
I mean, what are these people really fighting for? It's a metaphor, I know what they think they are fighting for, what they seem to fail to understand is the cost of the war. Both humanitarian and financial.
The money spent on arms could and should be spent on improving the countries welfare/economy. There are however, countries who develope and sell arms. Being unable to see how effective/reliable they are in their own countries, the arms are sold abroad to "help" other countries. (it is a large, profitable industry) For example, in the 6 day war in 1967, the aircraft used by Isreal were French Dassoulte Mirrage's (excuse spelling please!) whilst the aircraft used by Egypt were USSR MIG 15's, to name but two!
I could go on for "ages", but history appears to have a habit of repeating itsself and nothing appears to have been learnt!
(except how to make better weapons!)

[SARDINES]

My honest opinion on the matter is that both sides have done damage to the other... It's difficult to point fingers and debates can go on and on about "who started first". It's a matter of at what time frame you start looking at... how far back in history do you go to see who's fault it is? Which side pushed which side over the limit... I think both sides are guilty of this. I just feel that the entire matter is an ancient and modern day tragedy.

For those out there who enjoy reading, there is a great "fiction" novel out there called "EXILE" by Richard North Patterson. The fictional characters are on both sides of the line and the perspective of the tragedy from both sides. A great and fun read. A definite recommendation from the SARDINES

Cheers all
SARDINES

[villager]

Hi villager, I think I know what you mean?
To ensure peace, be ready for war (not my original comment, I juststillrememberit)
Sometimes I think "genocide" is the only way, but then, what would that make me?
I mean, what are these people really fighting for? It's a metaphor, I know what they think they are fighting for, what they seem to fail to understand is the cost of the war. Both humanitarian and financial.
The money spent on arms could and should be spent on improving the countries welfare/economy. There are however, countries who develope and sell arms. Being unable to see how effective/reliable they are in their own countries, the arms are sold abroad to "help" other countries. (it is a large, profitable industry) For example, in the 6 day war in 1967, the aircraft used by Isreal were French Dassoulte Mirrage's (excuse spelling please!) whilst the aircraft used by Egypt were USSR MIG 15's, to name but two!
I could go on for "ages", but history appears to have a habit of repeating itsself and nothing appears to have been learnt!
(except how to make better weapons!)

Hi SJBi now read this morning that the Iranian regime is trying to supply an even longer range missile ,The "FAJR" which is QUITE capable of hitting TEL AVIV , any one with half a brain know what will happen if HAMAS is so foolish into launching them onto ISRAEL ,I think it was the Roman general TACITUS who said, "IF YOU WANT PEACE YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARED TO FIGHT FOR IT".

[SARDINES]

Hi villager, I think I know what you mean?
To ensure peace, be ready for war (not my original comment, I juststillrememberit)
Sometimes I think "genocide" is the only way, but then, what would that make me?
I mean, what are these people really fighting for? It's a metaphor, I know what they think they are fighting for, what they seem to fail to understand is the cost of the war. Both humanitarian and financial.
The money spent on arms could and should be spent on improving the countries welfare/economy. There are however, countries who develope and sell arms. Being unable to see how effective/reliable they are in their own countries, the arms are sold abroad to "help" other countries. (it is a large, profitable industry) For example, in the 6 day war in 1967, the aircraft used by Isreal were French Dassoulte Mirrage's (excuse spelling please!) whilst the aircraft used by Egypt were USSR MIG 15's, to name but two!
I could go on for "ages", but history appears to have a habit of repeating itsself and nothing appears to have been learnt!
(except how to make better weapons!)

Hi SJBi now read this morning that the Iranian regime is trying to supply an even longer range missile ,The "FAJR" which is QUITE capable of hitting TEL AVIV , any one with half a brain know what will happen if HAMAS is so foolish into launching them onto ISRAEL ,I think it was the Roman general TACITUS who said, "IF YOU WANT PEACE YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARED TO FIGHT FOR IT".

I don't think that Tacitus ever met hard-line, hard-core fanatics on BOTH SIDES before. Both with extreme ideologies. I truly believe that the majority of both sides do want peace with one side not having to worry about a sucidal bomber blowing them up while having a cup of coffee in a cafe and the other side worried about a 2 ton bomb coming through the roof while they are sleeping.

The civilian casaulities of women and children are high on both sides. It's the hardcore fanatics on both sides who keep stirring up the brew. They've both taken pretty violent and dispicable swings at eachother countless times in the past.

If I were to play "devil's advocate" for EITHER SIDE, I would have an endless amount of critic for each side.

SARDINES

[SARDINES]

... AND to think that they both believe in the same God... only different prophets. For either the persons on either side who have committed acts of evil, I wonder how they must feel when they die and meet each other in the same Hell.

SARDINES

[villager]

... AND to think that they both believe in the same God... only different prophets. For either the persons on either side who have committed acts of evil, I wonder how they must feel when they die and meet each other in the same Hell.

SARDINES

Hi Sardines, When you get a proud father carrying his 4 year son on his shoulders dressed as a suicide bomber in Gaza , you know the depth of the problem, and a week before this present carnage started a month ago the worlds media saw the Israeli PM Olhmart PLEAD with HAMAS to cease firing their rockets into Southern Israel or they would suffer the consequences , if you read Hamas,s Charter , you may deduce that there will never be a lasting peace , especially when they are being bankrolled and armed by the hard line Iranian govt, the two Palestinian factions cannot even live in peace , never mind Israel .

[stilljustbrowsing]

What is Thailand's foreign policy?
May I refer people seeking the answer to look at the topic "visa issues". (irrespective of foreign origin)