Needless death of Thai Police Officer

[lawman1]

I am writing this post to express my condolences to the family of the Police Officer and the taxi driver killed needlessly on the 14th of March in Bangkok.
Having spent twenty years as a professional Police Officer and Deputy Sheriff in the USA I feel compelled to voice my feelings in this matter.
I was both disheartened and appalled at the story in the Bangkok Post on Friday regarding this preventable tragedy. Now you are probably wondering why I use the term "Preventable" when referring to this matter so let me explain myself.
To me it shows a severe lack of training, skills and coordination on the part of the Bangkok (Thai) Police. During my visit in Thailand I have observed the police in numerous situations [many in which unfortunately money had to change hands to provide passage of our taxi] as well as the weapons the individual officers are provided.
I have noticed that many, way too many of these officers are carrying revolvers, or what we call "Wheel guns" in the states instead of a department issued automatic. This is a major mistake on the part of the department heads. I was carrying an automatic as early as 1978 in California. By the mid 1980's most departments were issuing weapons to their officers, these being 9mm, 40cal or 45cal. The belief was they did not want their officers to be "outgunned" on the street.
During my stint as a deputy sheriff in California, the time I was employed as a police officer in the Reno Nevada area and finally my years with the Sheriff's Department in New Orleans, if I was not issued a handgun, I would carry my personal 9m or 45cal weapon thus providing me the advantage of from 30 to 45 rounds of available ammunition should I need it instead of the "6" shoots of the revolver, 18 if your considered 2 speed loaders. As well ALL sworn personnel were required to qualify on the POST range each year to maintain proficiency.
In the situation where this officer approached a vehicle, known to have been involved in violent attacks on citizens, theft of a vehicle, being armed and dangerous, not to mention the possibility that he was under the influence of drugs, the officer made a FATAL mistake of approaching and attempting to apprehend the suspect on his own..and act of bravado that cost him his life!,
In the real world of professional law enforcement in the USA - a police academy trained and field qualified officer has officer safety DRILLED into your head constantly. You are trained NOT to approach a vehicle, or an individual of vehicle suspected of being involved in a "Felony" type situation WITHOUT a cover or backup unit - officer(s), and with weapon out and at the ready. And you never approach a vehicle or suspect in these situations putting yourself in a position that will allow the suspect to harm you or obtain your weapon and use it against you!!
These acts on this officers part, as well as the actions of the officer that attempted to stop the vehicle on foot and was thus struck by the vehicle causing grievous bodily injuries were preventable and totally unnecessary! This tells me that the level of training and available weapons and equipment are sub-par.
It is unfortunate that this officer had to lose his life, a brother officer was seriously injured as well as a taxi driver killed in an incident that could have been prevented with the proper level of training and coordination.
I am hoping that this situation will come as a wake up call to the Thai police powers to be to provide a suitable weapon as well as training in the use of their weapons, and training in the proper actions to be taken and response to situations as these. I am sure as well that they could obtain the assistance of US law enforcement agencies to provide high qulity and up to date training to them if desired .
Again my heart goes out to the widows and children of the slain officer and taxi driver.

[Voice]

First I think America should change the gun law! make it impossible to get guns or buy one. I live in England for many years and to see police without gun make me feel very safe. Since we have terrorist activities and illegal imported guns we have seen the rise of police officers carry their fire arms. Even though they have good training mistake do happen which cost life. As human we do sometime over react in some situation. With gun in our hand it could means only one thing, a death of a person. I have seen many of the police programme on the television in England. It has shown the way the police are working in the United State. I believe that if you have guns or availability of guns then law enforcement won’t need to carry guns to protect it citizen.
In Thailand police officers has to buy their own uniform and sidearm for themselves. It doesn’t supply by it government like they should in many countries. So it is obvious that they don’t have much of the training when the government can’t even afford nor have enough budgets for the uniforms or gun training. Thai guns law carry 5 years sentences and gun license is very difficult to get. So it is possible that most people who have guns doesn’t have license. Thai police also need a license to carry firearms. I think the world would be a safe place if we could do without weapons like this.

[drake]

First I think America should change the gun law! make it impossible to get guns or buy one. I live in England for many years and to see police without gun make me feel very safe. Since we have terrorist activities and illegal imported guns we have seen the rise of police officers carry their fire arms.

Methinks you are reminiscing a wee bit much and now confusing it with reality.
Unarmed UK police is ancient history, bobbies had been carrying guns since the late 70s and now they are carrying MP5s.

Obviously, the lame gun control laws in the UK FAIL and now they are resorting to restricting sales of kitchen knives.
This, and you want the US to follow suit ?
NO THANK YOU.
Please stop blaming inanimate objects.
Banning them won't solve anything and you won't feel any safer.

Guns aren't at all difficult to get in Thailand if you know somebody and can afford one and/or don't care if it's legal.
The shooter in this episode got the gun from the policeman whom he stabbed so any gun restriction law was useless.

This tells me that the level of training and available weapons and equipment are sub-par.
It is unfortunate that this officer had to lose his life, a brother officer was seriously injured as well as a taxi driver killed in an incident that could have been prevented with the proper level of training and coordination.
I am hoping that this situation will come as a wake up call to the Thai police powers to be to provide a suitable weapon as well as training in the use of their weapons, and training in the proper actions to be taken and response to situations as these. I am sure as well that they could obtain the assistance of US law enforcement agencies to provide high qulity and up to date training to them if desired .

You are absolutely right.
While there are a few Military/Police personnel who are well trained and proficient with arms, the rest are not.
I doubt if anyone here had ever heard of the 21 ft rule.
Nobody here wears kevlar, it's just too expensive and too hot for words.
The police sidearms are potluck. As Voice pointed out, officers buy their own guns and ammo.
Dealers in the US only dream of being able to sell a generic Glock for $1300, here there's a waiting list at that price.
Ball ammo is $1 a pop.
Like the rest of govt. rank & file jobs here, the beat cop salary is a joke.
Who can afford to train on their own ?

2 days ago I was having lunch in Rayong when a VIP showed up, a vice-minister with a half dozen cops in tow.
Six different guns, no vest, no spare mag carrier, and nobody was using a retention holster.

[Voice]

Drake my friend I came to England in the late 60s and I’ve been here over 40 years. All my time here up until the mid-90s police don’t carry gun especially in the 70s for sure. The year of cowboy is long gone drake! But American still live their life like a cowboy. How many people killed by guns related crimes in America? Drake! How often did you hear the news that kids has been killed by another kids mad with gun. How many ganglands killing that happen every day in America? Do you really think that it’s good to have gun. AS I mention in my comment that I feel very safe in all my time here in England. But now I don’t feel so safe when I can see police carry guns around London.

[drake]

Drake my friend I came to England in the late 60s and I’ve been here over 40 years. All my time here up until the mid-90s police don’t carry gun especially in the 70s for sure.

Bro, don't know which England you lived in but obviously you weren't in London or weren't looking, or both.
FWIW, back then I would have been looking at girls in minis instead of the cops myself so I won't hold you accountable for that.
About a fifth of London police force carried sidearms back in the 70s, it's down to less than 10% now.
BUT numbers alone can be deceiving, back then they carried only pistols, now they carry machine guns plus pistols.

The year of cowboy is long gone drake! But American still live their life like a cowboy.

The cowboy era in the US is defined as the period around 1865 to 1900 'out west and south-west' and usually not in the cities or 'back east'. It's pretty much all history by WW1
It was really not that much of a 'culture' and nothing like what came out of Hollywierd for the following hundred years.
If by saying Cowboy you meant "self-determined individualists", THAT is what makes America great and I hope will continue to be that way - and it hasn't got much to do with guns.

How many people killed by guns related crimes in America? Drake!

About 6,500 a year and trending down.
Check it out for yourself: http://www.nij.gov/welcome.html & http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm
Actual (legal) gun ownership and total number of guns in the US has been going up during the same period.

How often did you hear the news that kids has been killed by another kids mad with gun. How many ganglands killing that happen every day in America?

Not THAT often and actually far less than automobile accidents.
(CDC reports here - http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/deaths.htm)

Do you really think that it’s good to have gun.

A bit of a loaded question.
I believe all free men who are capable and responsible should own firearms.
Individual defense should also be a personal responsibility and not a responsibility delegatged to the community.
If one is an able body, why isn't one sharing that social burden ?
As my friends in Law Enforcement advised "If you have an intruder in the house shoot them then call 911, you will be dead if you wait for us" much in opposition from the UK home office which tells people to "Call 999 and hide under the bed"

AS I mention in my comment that I feel very safe in all my time here in England. But now I don’t feel so safe when I can see police carry guns around London.

Friend, I'm afraid that is a false sense of security.
People tends to mistake the lack of zombie attack reports for promise of safety.
Perhaps you should look in to the history of (small)arms, conflicts/crimes, and (small)arms control in England.
You may notice finally that you'd been brainwashed by the establishment.
All Government of the world fear most not their outside enemies but their own armed population hence the ongoing global campaing to eliminate (small) arms from private ownership that you are a party to.

[Voice]

Yes drake 70s was good I had my best year with all the hip stuff like short minis and hot pant. Those day girl can walk late at night or early in the morning without been attack. There were no young guns like today. So we didn’t see much crime with young people back then. Gun is definitely not good for your health. Yes gun don’t kill people do but without the toll like gun I think will still have a fighting chance.

[drake]

Yes drake 70s was good I had my best year with all the hip stuff like short minis and hot pant. Those day girl can walk late at night or early in the morning without been attack.

Unless she ran in to Jack.

There were no young guns like today. So we didn’t see much crime with young people back then.

I'm sure you are familiar with Clockwork Orange ? That WAS the reflection of the time. I guess you were in the burbs or small town then to not have seen the brawling punks. Things were a lot less crowded then.

Gun is definitely not good for your health. Yes gun don’t kill people do but without the toll like gun I think will still have a fighting chance.

Wishful thinking that is.
If gun ban equals less crime how come UK is now having to resort to restricting sales of kitchen knives ?
I'm too old and out of shape to either try to engage the yobs or home invaders alone bare handed or run away.
Wish you never ever had to find out the hard way that these days they will hurt you just for fun.

[bystander1]

A revolver is perfectly fine for a policeman. Many officers around the world still carry revolvers.

Hong Kong police still carry revolvers and they are well trained and are not having any big issues.

Training is the main issue - we don't need militaristic American style policing in Thailand (along with the daily reports of police shooting unarmed suspects).