Abhisit: at what price?

[Chaiyuth]

Are you sure it's not "AIBAMARK"?
AI-BA-MARK....get it?
But still better than "EBAMARK" though.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++

Don't you know they now call him "OBAMARK"? Can anyone tell me how they come up with this comparison?

[villager]

villager witch part of, Thai politics forum, do you not understand. This is not about Spain but about Thailand here. Is it so hard for you to understand mate.

Sorry for the people not interested in my countries problem here. But an answer is asked for.

Spain is in economical troubles, because some silly folks in my country closed down the international airports in Spain and left thousand of people stranded. I hope that this is the answer you wanted to hear. Well we danced some flamenco for them and gave them food and water. You know, this is new standards in international travelling.

Of course some not so open minded tourist felt a bit strange seeing local people in the airport wearing baklavas and caring baseball bats. You know, we just wanted them to join a game of throwing a ball around and hitting it with the bats. Again, normal international procedures when taking over an airport.

Oh, and the barb wire around the airport was just their to keep the bulls out which escaped the bull running up North.

Please villager, give me a break and follow the advice I gave to some yellow fellow clapper friends of yours, stop using them clapping them against your head, it may leave you with some serious yellow damage in your brain.

You really refuse to give me a striaght answer as to why your country has hit the skids, or could it be that you ain,t a clue , to keep waffling on as you do and totally avoiding the question , frankly i find laughable

[Chaiyuth]

Just to add to the arguments above, today I took the trouble and called a Tourism Authority of Thailand representative to see what the situation is on the ground as a result of PAD. Keep in mind that this person is directly involved with this business, and the person was candid with me. I never said anything about my political leanings. I just wanted to know "what 's happening on the ground."

I asked if closing of the airports by PAD has affected Thai Tourism in anyway. The rep's answer was yes, many tours have canceled out because of "security" issues. Oh yes, people around the world do take airport security issues and security of their clients very seriously! Many countries still have not lifted their travel advisory on Thailand because they have no idea what's going to happen next with the airport. When this is the case, tour operators will not take any risks with their clients and they go elsewhere. The rep said at the moment, many 5-star hotels in Thailand have very little guests, which is unprecedented. The economic downturn may be creeping up all over, but tourism of Thailand has always survived through thick and thin, because the country was affordable and pleasant to visit. The rep also explained that while PAD was protesting at the bridge, tourism in Thailand was still doing fine despite recession elsewhere. During PAD's occupation of Government House and its violent protest at the Parliament, everybody in the tourism industry was keeping their fingers crossed hoping it wouldn't get much worse than this. But it did and PAD's occupation of the airports was the straw that broke the camel's back....

I have some friends in the tourism industry. One had to put his 5 tour buses on the market because he was behind on the payment. Another friend was losing 1 million baht/month in lost revenue. He still could not talk to me to this day about PAD has done to his family and co-workers.... One friend works for THAI Airways and was there during the take over. He was angry, frustrated, and at a loss that the people responsible for security of the airport failed to do anything. What PAD did was like killing the goose that lay golden eggs, or like cutting off the hand that feeds you. It's an insult to say what PAD did was morally justified or that their actions didn't cause any harm. People who say it was fun and game or just a minor inconvenience are mostly bureaucrats (active or retired) who have regular income paid for by taxpayers.

[villager]

Just to add to the arguments above, today I took the trouble and called a Tourism Authority of Thailand representative to see what the situation is on the ground as a result of PAD. Keep in mind that this person is directly involved with this business, and the person was candid with me. I never said anything about my political leanings. I just wanted to know "what 's happening on the ground."

I asked if closing of the airports by PAD has affected Thai Tourism in anyway. The reps answered was yes, many tours have canceled out because of "security" issues. Oh yes, people around the world do take airport security issues and security of their clients very seriously! Many countries still have not lifted their travel advisory on Thailand because they have no idea what's going to happen next with the airport. When this is the case, tour operators will not take any risks with their clients and they go elsewhere. The rep said at the moment, many 5-star hotels in Thailand have very little guests, which is unprecedented. The economic downturn may be creeping up all over, but tourism of Thailand has always survived through thick and thin, because the country was affordable and pleasant to visit. The rep also explained that while PAD was protesting at the bridge, tourism in Thailand was still doing fine despite recession elsewhere. During PAD's occupation of Government House and its violent protest at the Parliament, everybody in the tourism industry was keeping their fingers crossed hoping it wouldn't get much worse than this. But it did and PAD's occupation of the airports was the straw that broke the camel's back....

I have some friends in the tourism industry. One had to put his 5 tour buses on the market because he was behind on the payment. Another friend was losing 1 million baht/month in lost revenue. He still could not talk to me to this day about PAD has done to his family and co-workers.... One friend works for THAI Airways and was there during the take over. He was angry, frustrated, and at a loss that the people responsible for security of the airport failed to do anything. What PAD did was like killing the goose that lay golden eggs, or like cutting off the hand that feeds you. It's an insult to say what PAD did was morally justified or that their actions didn't cause any harm. People who say it was fun and game or just a minor inconvenience are mostly bureaucrats (active or retired) who have regular income paid for by taxpayers.

A fair comment Chaiyuth, but it begs the question just WHO should held responsible for letting the PAD mob into the airports in the first place?, the Police?,the Military?, the Govt in power at the time for not ring fencing them with guards, SURELY SOMEONE should bear full responsibility for the total fiasco which was allowed to happen. even if the was already in, they could easily have been forcefully removed within hours of them entering.

[Just-1-Voice]

The ones "Ultimately Responsible" can not be talked about, and can not be touched, and whether you like it or not, that's the bottom line.

[pachangamac042]

While there are some very serious and intelligent members in this forum, I see a growing number of quite ignºrant thick heads here as well. Same questions are being asked repeatedly and precise answers given, but it seems like some readers maybe do just not understand some of the answers.

TZ has explain many times here the situation of the Thai economy compared to Western country’s economies. Unfortunately it seems like it does not go into some peoples heads.

The tourism situation has been explained very accurately as well, but again some people do not want to understand. They do not accept the facts as they are.

In yesterday’s BP opinion section, http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opin ... -assurance, there were some more facts regarding tourism. But of course, some people here will keep saying that the downfall of tourism has not much to do with the yellow circus, but with the world economy.

Having been in the tourism business for many years after getting my degree as International Tourism Management Expert, I regard myself as a person knowing a bit about tourism. In today’s world, is travelling regarded as a basic need, comparable to eating.

Most people work hard all year long and safe money for the best time of their year, witch is their holiday. An economical crisis will not stop most people from travelling. Most people will safe money in other things like, going to the pub for a drink, dinning out, buying new clothes, buying a new telly, getting a new car, and so on.

Following a fact from leading European South East Asia tour operators and two major incoming tourism agencies in Thailand. Bookings for the 2008-2009 high season for Asia were on an all time high. After the closing of Suvarnabhumi there has been a wave of annulations for holidays in Thailand, while other Asian countries had no such annulations. The contrary was the case, destinations like Bali and Vietnam had an increase of bookings in December. That makes the PAD and the democrats who backed them directly responsible for the ruined high season.

Until today, nobody in Thailand has come up with any concepts to avoid airport takeovers in the future. Nor have there been any official words of regret or apologies. The contrary happened, Kasit told an audience of astonished diplomats and foreign journalists on Dec 19 in Bangkok, that the protests were "a lot of fun" and "the food was excellent, the music was excellent".

For that reason, are Thailand’s airports still seen by International Air Travel Associations, as high risk airports, which does not at all help tourism. Nobody in the current government seems to care at all about this situation or has some clear ideas how to improve this situation. That makes the current government directly responsible for low numbers in tourism.

Many international travel companies and airlines have lost a lot of money due to the airport closing, but no official person in Thailand has come up with some compensations. That for itself does keep certain companies away from Thailand. So again, it is the current government who is directly responsible for the decrease in tourism.

Abhi boy thinks, that it is enough just to tell the whole world that now everything is fine again in Thailand, but the world does not buy his empty words. The world wants to see actions. The world would like to hear honest words of regret. The involved companies would like to hear how at least some of their lost will be refunded. But it is obvious, that Abhi and his ministers have no idea how to tackle this situation and improve Thailand’s image in the world. They have no concept at all how to win the confidence of the travelers back. They just keep selling Thailand as the Land of Smiles, but this is an old hat and does not sell anymore. They keep selling Thailand as a country where you get good value for your money but they do not realize, that with today’s exchange rates and the high prize politics in tourism places, Thailand has become an expensive travel destination.

Tourism in Thailand is not dead but with the governments inactivity they are going to completely kill it. But of course, not Abhi’s mistake, he is new and does not know what he does. Just give him time, give him a chance. The problem is, that there is no time no more. He should have acted yesterday, but he is just to busy buying roses for other guys.

[villager]

The ones "Ultimately Responsible" can not be talked about, and can not be touched, and whether you like it or not, that's the bottom line.

Quite correct J1V, anyone with half a brain knows the truth of the Matter, maybe the "NOODLE COOK" would like to weigh in with her thoughts , mind you, with slaveing over a hot WOK for 12 hours, and in the night thinking of ways to avoid direct question,s whilst sticking pins in dolls of Abhisit has his cabinet she ain,t much time on her hands these days, , the Hilight of her evening i,m informed is to retire to the sleeping chamber with a life sized blow up effigy of her "HERO" the good "doctor "Thaksin,LOLOLOLOL.

[villager]

While there are some very serious and intelligent members in this forum, I see a growing number of quite ignºrant thick heads here as well. Same questions are being asked repeatedly and precise answers given, but it seems like some readers maybe do just not understand some of the answers.

TZ has explain many times here the situation of the Thai economy compared to Western country’s economies. Unfortunately it seems like it does not go into some peoples heads.

The tourism situation has been explained very accurately as well, but again some people do not want to understand. They do not accept the facts as they are.

In yesterday’s BP opinion section, http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opin ... -assurance, there were some more facts regarding tourism. But of course, some people here will keep saying that the downfall of tourism has not much to do with the yellow circus, but with the world economy.

Having been in the tourism business for many years after getting my degree as International Tourism Management Expert, I regard myself as a person knowing a bit about tourism. In today’s world, is travelling regarded as a basic need, comparable to eating.

Most people work hard all year long and safe money for the best time of their year, witch is their holiday. An economical crisis will not stop most people from travelling. Most people will safe money in other things like, going to the pub for a drink, dinning out, buying new clothes, buying a new telly, getting a new car, and so on.

Following a fact from leading European South East Asia tour operators and two major incoming tourism agencies in Thailand. Bookings for the 2008-2009 high season for Asia were on an all time high. After the closing of Suvarnabhumi there has been a wave of annulations for holidays in Thailand, while other Asian countries had no such annulations. The contrary was the case, destinations like Bali and Vietnam had an increase of bookings in December. That makes the PAD and the democrats who backed them directly responsible for the ruined high season.

Until today, nobody in Thailand has come up with any concepts to avoid airport takeovers in the future. Nor have there been any official words of regret or apologies. The contrary happened, Kasit told an audience of astonished diplomats and foreign journalists on Dec 19 in Bangkok, that the protests were "a lot of fun" and "the food was excellent, the music was excellent".

For that reason, are Thailand’s airports still seen by International Air Travel Associations, as high risk airports, which does not at all help tourism. Nobody in the current government seems to care at all about this situation or has some clear ideas how to improve this situation. That makes the current government directly responsible for low numbers in tourism.

Many international travel companies and airlines have lost a lot of money due to the airport closing, but no official person in Thailand has come up with some compensations. That for itself does keep certain companies away from Thailand. So again, it is the current government who is directly responsible for the decrease in tourism.

Abhi boy thinks, that it is enough just to tell the whole world that now everything is fine again in Thailand, but the world does not buy his empty words. The world wants to see actions. The world would like to hear honest words of regret. The involved companies would like to hear how at least some of their lost will be refunded. But it is obvious, that Abhi and his ministers have no idea how to tackle this situation and improve Thailand’s image in the world. They have no concept at all how to win the confidence of the travelers back. They just keep selling Thailand as the Land of Smiles, but this is an old hat and does not sell anymore. They keep selling Thailand as a country where you get good value for your money but they do not realize, that with today’s exchange rates and the high prize politics in tourism places, Thailand has become an expensive travel destination.

Tourism in Thailand is not dead but with the governments inactivity they are going to completely kill it. But of course, not Abhi’s mistake, he is new and does not know what he does. Just give him time, give him a chance. The problem is, that there is no time no more. He should have acted yesterday, but he is just to busy buying roses for other guys.

Mac, you really have lost the plot ain,t you? I quote you" MOST PEOPLE WORK HARD ALL YEAR LONG AND SAVE MONEY FOR THE BEST TIME OF THE YEAR", get a reality check for gods sake, try and tell that to the OVER 3 million who ain,t got a job to work hard in the first place in your country Spain alone, and the dole queues are going inexorably bigger by the day not just in Spain, but all over the World , your statement holds about as much water as a car park puddle,LOLOLOLOL.

[Just-1-Voice]

Being retired has some definite advantages, such as being able to sit in front of my computer and read as much as I want, which is something I engage in most days, as I always try to get as much knowledge and information as I possibly can in regards to politics and world economy. Here are some things I’ve seen in the various websites that relate to Thailand.

1) The world economy is in the pits, no doubt about it, and while that also includes Thailand, Thailand was (and I use the past tense here) in a better position to deal with this than most countries because the banks held strong positions and didn’t overextend themselves the way banks in the U.S. and most other countries did.

2) While Thailand was feeling the economic “pinch”, their own government officials have stated, on more than one occasion, that the occupation of the airport by PAD was an action that definitely and seriously hurt the Thai economy on a broad scale.

3) Their actions are two-fold in destruction. First, it has discouraged tourists from coming to Thailand, and they are now looking at places such as Vietnam, Malaysa and Bali, which they consider less expensive (more on this to follow), and much safer as well. Second, because of this shift in destinations, over a million and a half Thai who are employed in the tourism industry will lose their jobs. Hotel occupancy is down to the point where many hotels are shutting off lights and closing down rooms in an effort to try and save money, as well as slashing their room prices by 5% in order to try and attract some business.

4) When I said they are going to countries they consider less expensive, it is because, from many of the things I’ve read, they think Thailand, and more specifically Bangkok, has priced itself out of the market in many ways. Prior to the current situation, hotels were raising their prices to a rate that was nearly double that of just 2 years ago. I’ve read numerous accounts where people are screaming bloody murder at the blatant refusal of meter taxi drivers to use their meters and are charging people exorbitant prices. One woman said she even complained to the police about it, but the only answer she got was “It’s not our jurisdiction.”

5) The week following the takeover of the airport, one newspaper reported that Ten Thousand German tourists canceled their reservations to Thailand, and shifted them to other counties, i.e.; Vietnam & Malaysia. How many other tourists that we don't know about from other countries have done that as well?

6) World leaders and travel agencies have not removed Thailand from the list of the 20 Most Dangerous Countries. As a result, many tour companies are directing tourists to choose other destinations.

7) As has been mentioned by INK and others, people save money all year for their vacation, even doing without other things just so they can have that one or two week respite and relax, even during economic times such as the world is facing now.

8) Thailand’s own Minister for tourism stated that, even with the current global economic situation, they still estimated that Thailand would have about 15.5 million tourists this year, but as a “direct result of the actions of PAD” they now estimate that figure will be cut in half, if not more.

9) Tourism figures for Vietnam & Malaysia have not declined. In fact, they have actually increased, while the bottom has fallen out of tourism for Thailand.

10) The current government’s program for “restoring confidence” in Thailand will not succeed until the government can show that they are willing to prosecute those responsible for the take over of the airport, not reward them with cushy government jobs, and prove that they can prevent such an event from happening in the future, which is something they are incapable of doing at this time. Until Abhist backs up his words that those who violate the law must be held accountable, and the leaders of PAD are arrested, not given government jobs, there's no way he's going to "restore confidence" in Thailand in the eyes of the rest of the world.

11) I had invited 3 couples to come to Chiang Mai for Songkarn, and all 3 had made reservations to come. However, after the takeover of the airport, all 3 couples contacted me to say that they were cancelling their plans because, no matter what I said, their safety could not be assured or guaranteed, and they did not want to come here and get caught up in something political for which they had no involvement.

[Voice]

Vellager, It was the military who should be held responsible as they has warned the police to kept themselves at bay, that was the reason why there weren’t any fencing or police to be seen at good distances.