Is Farang an f word?

Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby Michael Bukit on Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:58 pm

sulasno wrote:1/2 Thai + 1/2 British is not Farang :lol: :lol: :lol:

it's something else Image



It is called "Luk Kung" Thai used it wisely with no intension of insulting. Just a normal word.
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby missmarnip on Wed Jul 29, 2009 5:27 pm

i'm a hyphenated thai myself and was brought up in bkk. the word farang was never used by our family as a swear word. we even refer to ourselves as farangs. i have to add that we also used khon tang chat in an equal amount as the f word. but when we moved to europe i was confronted with learning a new language and have been from then quite more aware of contexts of words.
i think i wouldn't lightly use farang anymore although it still doesn't feel that offensive to me. but maybe that's b/c my infamous thai racism/ignorance is deeper rooted than i want to admit (no sarcasm intended here).
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby sulasno on Wed Jul 29, 2009 5:29 pm

yeah, it's "lôok krêung"

according to Thai2English.com, the definition is half-caste ; half-breed :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby taysahai on Wed Jul 29, 2009 5:37 pm

Farang is a derivative of Francais used to describe everyone of european descent, a.k.a. caucasion, which includes all of europe, australia, white americans, canadians, people of spanish descent in s. america. etc. etc. If not that, you might be called kaek/indian, yun,yi-poon/japanese islam/arab , jeen/chinese kori/korea, etc.

According to you these following phrases are offensive.

Their is alot of danes in Koh Samet.
Their is an arab district in bangkok.
Their is alot of europeans on the 3rd floor.
I think Korean girls are hot.
Their is alot of Indians in Bali.

The term Khon Tang Chaad/pratet is politically more correct and polite then Falang, but almost too much, it is more of something you would find in writing. In speech it would be 3 words and require modifiers.

Khon- person/persons
Tang-different
chaad-race

According to you, in your own speech you speak like this.

Someone else "What did the man look like"
You " He was A PERSON OF DIFFERENT RACE WITH FAIR SKIN

or. He was WHITE.
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby missmarnip on Wed Jul 29, 2009 5:43 pm

taysahai wrote:Farang is a derivative of Francais used to describe everyone of european descent, a.k.a. caucasion, which includes all of europe, australia, white americans, canadians, people of spanish descent in s. america. etc. etc. If not that, you might be called kaek/indian, yun,yi-poon/japanese islam/arab , jeen/chinese kori/korea, etc.

\\ ////, doesn't farang and kaek fall into the same category but yi-poon and jeen are actually the thai pronunciations/names for those countries? ri ben sounds a lot like yi-poon (japan) and muang jeen refers to zhong guo (china).
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby Eggmeng on Wed Jul 29, 2009 6:10 pm

Farang is a derivative of Francais used to describe everyone of european descent, a.k.a. caucasion, which includes all of europe, australia, white americans, canadians, people of spanish descent in s. america. etc. etc. If not that, you might be called kaek/indian, yun,yi-poon/japanese islam/arab , jeen/chinese kori/korea, etc.
According to you these following phrases are offensive.

Their is alot of danes in Koh Samet.
Their is an arab district in bangkok.
Their is alot of europeans on the 3rd floor.
I think Korean girls are hot.
Their is alot of Indians in Bali.



No these are not offensive. Why is this so difficult for some people to understand? Calling Europeans as a group, whites or Caucasian is correct. So is identifying them by nationality as you have done in your examples, if there is a need to do so for some reason. But '"Farang" is the equivalent of "Chinaman" and used to lump all whites together. One reason why so many people are disgusted to hear this word, is because farang is so often linked with another word to form a deragatory phrase. We have already listed many in this thread.

Or here's a more pedestrian example, and the most widespread and therefore irritating use of the f word. Let's say you are a Thai visiting the USA. You are seated at a restaurant. You hear the waitress say to her colleague:

a) Did you give those customers menus yet?
b) Did you give those Chinamen menus yet?

Which would you prefer?

The term Khon Tang Chaad/pratet is politically more correct and polite then Falang, but almost too much, it is more of something you would find in writing. In speech it would be 3 words and require modifiers.



Khon- person/persons
Tang-different
chaad-race

Sorry, what? Khon tang chat is too difficult to say? How about Khon Europe? Boy that's a mouthful huh?


According to you, in your own speech you speak like this.
Someone else "What did the man look like"
You " He was A PERSON OF DIFFERENT RACE WITH FAIR SKIN
or. He was WHITE.


Yes I would say he was white and then be specific if need be. (People PLEASE read the entire thread before commenting.) But your example is misleading. Farang is used all the time to refer to people when there is NO NEED to identify them by appearance. To borrow an expression historically used by the Jews, "If you ever forget you're a foreigner, a Thai will remind you."
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby 30+YearResident on Wed Jul 29, 2009 6:20 pm

I'm not a historian, but many Thai friends have told me that the first majority of Caucasians in formal relationships or contact with Thailand were from France, which in Thai is "Farangsait = ฝรั่งเศส, hence the beginning of referring to all Caucasians as "farang", which without other explicatives, carries no derogatory or negative meaning whatsoever. It's just part of the Thai style use of their own language. This is quite different from the Hong Kong Chinese term "fwan gwailo" which literally translates as "white ghost".

I relate this as being very similar the Thai term "Kleurang Kom" = a "Kom engine or machine" when Thais know this term refers to a computer. If a Thai asks a Thai if they know how to use a computer, more frequently than not, they use the single term "Kom". I think if any farang called a computer a "Com" they would certainly get strange looks from anybody within hearing distance. I was taught from an early age "When in Rome, do as the Romans do".

After 16 years in Thailand, and you feel still disturbed at being referred to as a farang and the urgent need to teach a nation of 60+ million Thais how they should use their language to be politically correct and polite to fit your own attitude, perhaps you should consider living elsewhere.
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby keechang on Wed Jul 29, 2009 6:26 pm

Following is an interesting linguistic search result about the origins of the Siamese "Frank" word.

A teaser.
=====
"The word is attested in various forms in languages in Europe, Africa,
the Middle East, South Asia, and Southeast Asia. It is clear that the
word orginated as "Frank" in Europe and spread eastwards along Muslim
trade routes.

Thai most likely borrowed the word from influential Muslim Persian or
Indian traders in the 17th century or even earlier. The Persian word was
"farangg". The term probably was used to refer to early Portuguese
traders and subsequently to all Europeans (ie., non-Muslims)."

Found at : http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/9149/farang.html
======
A more detailed research can be consulted there:
thai.hawaii.edu/thaiarc/farang-gwyn/farang1.txt
thai.hawaii.edu/thaiarc/farang-gwyn/farang2.txt

Learn and enjoy your days in Thailand!
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby moosatay on Wed Jul 29, 2009 6:41 pm

"farang kee nok" is not a farang at all. It's a term used to describe Thais who are farang wanna bes. A full blooded Thai who may have lived abroad ( a few years) upon returning to Thailand has adopted the western way of eating, dressing and mixing Thai and English words when speaking.
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Re: Is Farang an f word?

Postby Eggmeng on Wed Jul 29, 2009 6:55 pm

I'm not a historian, but many Thai friends have told me that the first majority of Caucasians in formal relationships or contact with Thailand were from France, which in Thai is "Farangsait = ฝรั่งเศส, hence the beginning of referring to all Caucasians as "farang", which without other explicatives, carries no derogatory or negative meaning whatsoever. It's just part of the Thai style use of their own language. This is quite different from the Hong Kong Chinese term "fwan gwailo" which literally translates as "white ghost".

I relate this as being very similar the Thai term "Kleurang Kom" = a "Kom engine or machine" when Thais know this term refers to a computer. If a Thai asks a Thai if they know how to use a computer, more frequently than not, they use the single term "Kom". I think if any farang called a computer a "Com" they would certainly get strange looks from anybody within hearing distance. I was taught from an early age "When in Rome, do as the Romans do".

After 16 years in Thailand, and you feel still disturbed at being referred to as a farang and the urgent need to teach a nation of 60+ million Thais how they should use their language to be politically correct and polite to fit your own attitude, perhaps you should consider living elsewhere.]


I think most Westerners who've lived here for more than a few years are familiar with the origins of the f word, but thanks all the same. I believe the first French were probably called farang because the color of their skin resembled the inside of the fruit. I don't think these facts make the constant modern use of the word to lump all whites together any less objectionable.

I made it clear in my first two posts that I don't expect to convert the entire Thai population to my way of thinking. Nor do I have an urgent need to persuade anyone of anything. I would like to think however, that I might get some of the expat community and the editors of English language publications here, to reconsider using the word in print as though it were perfectly acceptable usage, and thus set a good example.

If after reading my posts in this thread some are not swayed even a little bit, I don''t think anything I might add will change their minds.

And I might have known that as usual, it would be suggested that rather than try to influence a few people in a positive way, I should instead pack up and leave.
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