Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby adamt64 on Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:51 pm

This rule is a double-standard, where Thais don't get visa without knowledge of the native languages in those countries, but citizens of those countries get visas in Thailand without any knowledge of Thai (or English for some Germans). English is supposedly the second language of Thailand though, so the Brits are trying to do a couple of things with their rules. The Germans are flexing their might and distaste of the SE Asian prostitutes obviously. Like it or not, Thailand is famous for supplying prostitutes, drugs addicts, and other criminal types worldwide, and Thais sometimes become a nuisance to foreign nations with social welfare, treatment, rehabilitation, etc. These new rules, if they're strictly enforced, represent the power of the G8 nations and their distrust of outsiders. Thailand is an efficiency economy according to the World Economic Forum whereas the G8 wants innovation economies and their people. Those countries are slowed down and burdened by their own people, and can't afford to or don't want to give so many privileges to foreigners, but that's not unique in this world either. There's a double standard on the other side too, though, in the naturalization rights of Thais who marry citizens of those nations as opposed to the non-reciprocal rights of citizens of those nations who marry Thais in Thailand...the rights to buy property and lack thereof is another double-standard which favours Thais rather than oh well! Thai women should probably start getting a clue about what's going on in the world and if they have so much to say and if they can defend themselves so well, then they should learn how to speak a little so people can understand them...and the foreign men should probably make a couple of changes too. English and German are not like Thai either, so non-native speakers attempting to speak those languages will likely have more luck than Thai second language speakers. It's not a perfect world. This isn't a conspiracy, and it's not such a great injustice if we're to be honest about the entire issue.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby DocN on Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:48 pm

"Anyone who would lower himself to marry a bargirl, in the first place has major self-worth issues. Is it so difficult to find a good Thai girl from a decent family who has enough self-respect not to prostitute herself?"

WTF? Who the hell are you beau08/15? These girls -like it or not- are doing A JOB! A job that thai and farang men alike exploit to the fullest every evening! Some of them, having a wife at home! "Lower himself"? What kind of elite-bulls*it is that? I know MANY bar girls, I have been in love with one and guess what: she was even from Isaan! And if her mother wouldnt have been to greedy, I would be still with her! I will NEVER in a million years say anything bad about that woman. She TRIED to get out of that vicious circle: not having a propper education (been taken out of school at the age of ten to work on the rice fields or as a construction worker or what ever...why? Because Thai society doesn't give a flying f*ck about that!), trying to learn reading and writing (thai and english...I paid for it and I have seen it!), trying to get another job and not to work in a bar...
It's intellectual low-lifes like you beau666 who exactly want those girls where they are! Black and white is so easy, huh?!
Lower himself my as*! Noone can get lower that someone who constantly look down on others, my racist friend!
Think about, you hi-so-dweller, next time when jerk of to some porn-cd, you bought!

Oh and by the way: is! Because these "thai girls from a decent family" often see a relationship as a carreer move, themselves! They are not better than your direspected bar-girls. They only hide it a little better.

Please, all you decent, nice, tolerant people out there: I am not talking about you!
But if people like beau911 here, presenting themselves as intolent twats, I can't hold back!
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby geraldbofa on Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:56 pm

I have never posted a reply to any forum, although reading a lot of posts, but with this topic I'm going to make an exception.
First of all, I'm a German married to one of those Esaan girls, far younger than me, who had a CV as described in some of the posts, like bad education, having to work in the rice fields from an early age on, take care of the children of her sisters and so on and so forth.
After a time of 1 1/2 years of thinking of whether or not we should marry and where we should live then, we decided to get married and went for Germany.
It was a lenghtly process to get the visa for her and we were forced to have some German training for her at the Goethe Institute in Bangkok. After she finally was allowed to live with her married husband, we were obliged to send her to the so called integration training in Germany. That was a 640 hours half-day German language training for which we had to pay 100 € / month. After she finished with a good score, we got the money back, so the effective cost of the training was 0.
The benefits were, that she has now a good ability to express herself and even more important got to know different people from several different countries and cultural backgrounds (ranging from New Zealanders to Turkish people, from Kazakh to Chinese). We have now a quite interesting circle of fellows, we still meet and have fun with.
So if you would ask me, I would say yes, knowing the language is absolutely neccessary, if you don't want to sit at home waiting for your wife or husband and feeling completely lonely and homesick.
But I do not like, that people are forced to learn the language before they want to enter the country, as we found that the trainings she got in Bangkok where ok, but afterwards she had noone to practice and the learned faded away very fast.
The obligation to do the integration training I find a good thing, and that you have to pay for it at first, is also ok, just to give you some reason to attend. And when you are sucessful, you get the money back.
One more word to the marriage, the cultural problems, the Thai girls only want money, Farangs not welcome in Thailand and the like.
If this is a bad as it is described, then why are so many farangs still living in Thailand ? Why would you want to retire somewhere, where you are not welcome ? Why would you marry someone who wants you for money and not your person ?
We, my wife and I have the same amount of money to pay back to the bank for the house. we both work daily and have our 'daily torture'. Yes we are different, but if you have the right respect for each other and treat each other well, why shouldn't that work ?
Hope this is not embarrasing to anyone, my English is not too bad and I will not have to apologize to anyone.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby prommee_NE on Sun Sep 26, 2010 1:04 am

Just to add to the above:

As a non-German who has resided in Germany for many years the rules are:

A member of the EU, and his/her dependants can reside in Germany indefinitely without having to take any language proficiency test (although it helps to speak some German if you are going to live there).

A non member of the EU has two years to pass a language proficiency test...If they fail after two years they will have problems getting a new visa.

Schools have been set up for teaching German at a very low cost (I was unaware that the money was refundable...although I think in Bavaria the courses are free so it probably depends on region). Most major Companies also run free language training programs for their non German speaking employees

So IF Thailand wishes to make it compulsory to learn Thai in order to get/renew a visa then maybe they should look at the German system. The problem would probably be the ability to run courses that are easily accessible and of minimal cost to make them attractive enough for foreigners to learn a language that they can only use in a very small area of the world.

As long as people are resigned to the fact that they cannot change things...things won't change. It applies generally but in this case the Education System. It takes people LIKE YOU, who are experienced in teaching in the Country and have a good reputation to change things, rather than people like me who frequent a remote village and try and install some sort of innovation.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby ramdom on Fri Oct 15, 2010 12:32 pm

C'mon, I don't think anyone is so great that they can judge anyone else as better or worse, even though I'm going to a bit of it in this post :twisted: . Beau58, your problem is that you think YOUR idea of what is acceptable is correct and everything else is not. Everyone's entitled to fall in love, and women in Thai bars tailored for farangs as a population are not much worse than the general populace. In the US, there are zillions of stories of women cheating on men (and vice versa of course), taking them to the cleaners, etc. and ALL of these people are NOT those who work in bars! So it's possible that a woman who works these bars might end up being a more loyal and smarter partner than someone who is college educated. The number of women who may cheat and play around with farangs is no more, I think, than the number of farangs who cheat around and play around with these women. So it's all quid pro quo.

Working in a bar doesn't make one any less inferior to someone who doesn't, as your comments imply. It takes all kinds in this world, and people have to survive. Some people are fortunate enough to be afforded, and to seize, opportunities to be professors (like you and me), and some people clean toilets, and some people work in bars. It's a profession, and some do it even though it destroys their soul. I see by your comments you look down on this, but in my view, THAT makes you more unenlightened than anyone who would sell their body for the sake of money. I often say that people who work for corporate America prostitute their minds. People in general sell something, and you do too, as a professor, since you had to get paid somehow. Your judgements simply indicate unenlightened thinking (particularly in the Buddhist sense).

The problem also is your role as an academic. I'm an academic also, a professor who's been honoured at the highest levels here in the US and who's been offered honorary professorships at Kasetsart and Mahidol (and Chulalongkorn if I desired though the problem is I'm told by a Chancellor that the U moves slowly when it comes to cutting edge science), all by the young age of 38 (I got my tenure at 32), and I can tell you we tend to live in an Ivory Tower. I am familiar with higher education in Thailand in science in all geographical areas quite well. Your comments indicate that you too are kind of out of touch, like many academics, as to what is happening on the ground. Every person is an individual, and people just don't have opportunities. If people are given these, they too will love to learn. I see education in Thailand generally on a slow ramp up. It is moving out of an agrarian way of thinking to one based on innovation, but it is slow. But given my numerous Thai graduate and postdoctoral students that I've mentored, I will say Thai people are as capable of innovation as anyone else in the world.

I've given talks at Chulalongkorn, Mahidol, Kasetsart, etc. you name it, and I can tell you the humanity and the intelligence that happens in Chula (who are highly educated and extremely smart) is also present when you sit on the barstool on Sukhumvit or Silom (perhaps at a lower frequency, but that's natural in any place in the world). But both are opportunities to learn and you learn different things and skills.

Where I am, we have tons of Thai restaurants and many are run by people who've had no more than a grade 6 education in Thailand, and some can't read and write in English! Yet the ones who've done this for several years or decades, their entrepreneurial skill would match or exceed that of your average MBA. So you overstate formal education. All people are capable of everything.

If two people are happy, it doesn't matter how that happiness occur. I can't think of anything better than all the rich farangs marrying all the women who work in bars finding great matches and living happily ever after. If that happens, there's nothing wrong with that and in fact, would be a great equaliser and testament to globalisation. So more power to the farangs who've taken the plunge and the women in the bars who're willing to leave their homeland and go to a foreign country for the sake of love.

I've defended the women working in bars, but I'll also defend the farangs who choose the lifestyle of going to an Isaan village and hanging out there, or those that open bars in Koh Chang. If that's what they choose and that's what makes them happy, who are you to judge that is any less better than your choice? Your judgements are what is telling (so I suppose are my judgements of you but I'll do it this time to enlighten you :mrgreen: ).

As far as money, a million baht, or 50K/month, is small change for some people. If they have it, why not spend it? I personally don't believe in the concept of dowry and can argue it out intellectually with a Thai person, but if you buy into it, why limit it? I'd say spend based on how happy you feel, and take care, as in any situation, and enter it with your eyes open. And screw all the naysayers.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby ghostrider on Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:47 am

I am married to a really nice Thai Lady and I do not think just because a Thai lady marries a Foriegner she is bad. That is just backwards thinking in a modern world.
I do however think that if any "person" marries another nationality that there should be a understanding of both languages for both persons. If there is a requirement for a Thai person to pass a test on the language of the husband, then it is a Thai Government requirement and not a foriegn requirement.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby prajna on Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:02 am

BigJay wrote:
Well, this regulation is both fair and unfair. I am one of the Thai women who is about to marry a German guy. The unfair point for me is that, I graudated with bachelor degree from the USA and double master degrees from the Netherlands and I still have to pass a German test before getting marry.

To Modsquad... As you traveld and studied the world I'm sure you'll have no problem getting the VISA. You know why? Because you are obviously very, very,very,very rich. 99.9% of Thai's who travel to western countries for any reason most especially for studying are spolied rich. So no need to worry. As with everything else for the rich, your daddies pocket book will pay for everything.

and please don't try to deny it. We all know you are amongst the Bangkok ELITE when it comes to cash money!!

Dear Khun BigJay,

That's so unfair of you to misdirect your anger at Khun Modsquad. Your understanding of Thailand's educational realities is inconclusive. You're correct that there are indeed such rich families. But there are also many Thais who don't fit such descriptions that you perhaps don't know of or are aware of.

From personal experience, I can attest that it doesn't take money to study abroad or travel the world. In many developing countries, there are poor citizens who excel academically with hard work. They apply for and receive scholarships to study in foreign countries. Have you ever met any of these scholars originally from humble backgrounds? At night, they study at home in rural areas without electricity for lighting. Perhaps they have to carry water from a well to their houses as well.

Likewise, there are employers who sponsor such overseas trips (conferences, short-term assignments, job transfers, etc.).

I'm a Thai woman who now resides in the States. My poor family is from Ubon, where we lived until 1975 when the U.S. withdrew its troops as well as political and financial commitments, and my Thai father lost his job at an American airbase as a result. School text books left at the abandoned base became my ticket to learning; I started by looking at pictures but learned little since I'm not so smart. To help my family, I worked like everyone else by making paper bags from newspaper prints and gluing them with tapioca starch and collecting and selling recycling materials. Eventually, I went to college and got a degree from one of the well known universities in Bangkok. Stocking and shelving library books, periodic paid internships at college, doing part-time, temporary gigs for political campaigns and selling raffle tickets at annual Thai Red Cross fairs (งานกาชาด) helped pay for some college tuitions. My parents also supported me.

It was my jobs based in the U.S. that took me to around the world. I took time off for vacation by extending my stay when work sent me overseas. I used per diem put aside to pay for personal lodging and accommodation.

Very, very, very, very rich among 99.9% of Thais? Nah. I shop at Wal-Mart for expired bread at 40% off. I eat two small meals a day and drink tap water. To save money.

You may have to switch to a small paint brush before starting to broad-brush a portrait of someone like Khun Modsquad.
Last edited by prajna on Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby modsquad on Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:05 am

by modsquad on Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:11 pm

Comment from Khun Pampan

Well, this regulation is both fair and unfair. I am one of the Thai women who is about to marry a German guy. The unfair point for me is that, I graudated with bachelor degree from the USA and double master degrees from the Netherlands and I still have to pass a German test before getting marry.

Yes, I am non-EU citizen, but this regulation doesn't apply to those who are from developed countries such as Japan and Korea. Do they speak English or German better than me? I don't think so. That is why I said it is not fair.

However, if you look at the integration point, it is good for Thai women to be able to go outside interacting with the others, they can take part time job or classes.

Hello Big Jay,
The comment was made by Khun Pampan as you can see. I merely reposted from the newspaper as it seemed relevant to the thread. Perhaps you should direct your message to K Pampan!
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby ozie on Thu Feb 17, 2011 3:03 am

This can be seen as discrimanotory, here in Australia we have people come from all over the world , a lot of persons like myself can not write or read proply, the truth is Australia realises a parminant visa with a Tax file NO can aply for Centerlink payments , but if no serious atemt is made to find work ,edtehr by education or inploiment they do not want more people from overseas. on the other hand . a simple temprary visitors visa is ofter revuced in Bankok , by asumbtions of non genuane intend. if you like such a visa we can protect your aplication , to get your travel rights to Australia for visit only .
this will give you a income back in your country Thailand , after been trained in Australia. this will cost nothing to you until you are granted a visitors visa , you might qualivy sponcership for your airfare , for more information write to PO Box 1391 Victor Harbour South Australia 5211. your potential is in your ouwn country. ask me how. you do not have to mary a old man to make something of your live . thank you oswald.
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Re: Do you speak English Khun Noy?

Postby greeniecat on Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:59 pm

Your attitude towards these poor people is appaling.
These people who may be born unlucky to remote villages, poor uneducated parent or were sold into W... house or forced by their relatives to work in those sleazy bars. Futhermore, not all the people who want and posses an academy ability or can get access to opportunity to better themself, education costs money lots of money in any countries. They may have different outlooks of life as to your own, and for that they should be called a stain in the society according to you pompous description
For your information.. in richer and affluent countries, there are younger girls who droped out of school or colleges and choose to work in the bars or essort services to entertain men/women? That calls choice or circumtance just likes you have your.
Lets just hope that the half-aged girlfriend of your does truly love your in very physical sense of boyfriend and girlfriend and you swept off her feet by your physical attributions?? or may be because your are doing her a favour? and CHOOSE her?

Question 1.
Would she still be interested in you and only you if it wasn't for the colour of your passport?
Although you (her boyfriend) is as old as her Daddy, but a Westerner and therefore can vastly improve her image or status amongst her peers? her family? chance to settle in foreign land?
Question 2.
Can you get a college educated girlfriend, with decent job & good pays and only half your age in your own country?
Be real Mr. Professor and don't be too smug, I suggest you to take a good look in the mirror with your half-age girlfriend together.
The reality is that you are an old farrang with a girl half your age wraps around you - it's not a good look IMO - it's quite sad actually.
What makes you apart from the men who seem to lose all the sense the moment they hope on the planes to Thailand?
Things that make them feel alive, care for and appreciate (hahaha) .... Sex + nice younger girl Mr. Professor just like your.
But unlike you, they don't glorified themselves...
Btw I am not Thai woman or man
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