Dissolve parliament? Have new election? What is new election good for if PAD won't recognize the result anyway until they get elected and have enough votes to form government themselves? The country is really sinking to abyss. PAD claims themselves as an elite group but what they're out there on the street disrupting public and society is simply a group of thug who don't respect any rule of law, period, What a hypocrite they are.
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I do not understand why the PAD is so powerful and the police cannot do anything to do. In my TV, I can see those PAD people carrying guns and shooting around. Let me just emphasize again PAD carrying guns!!!
For a democratic society, everyone is fair and have a chance to vote whether they are coming from North or South. If the PAD does not recognise the current government who is elected by majority of the people, why claim to be democracy. I feel that there is no ending if people do not obey law, the PAD will not be happy if PPP is the ruling government even though is a legally elected government.
There is only one word to describe the Thailand politic ..... PATHETIC!
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MeePuak wrote:.....and lets not forget to note that the so-called leaders are doing it from well behind the front line!!
The PAD leaders are inciting TREASON while using the ////// to hide their true agenda. They are mere thugs, similar to the Reds in Russia when they took power, and look what happened after that!!! Do we want the same in Thailand? NO!
It's time PAD stopped this farce. Everyone can see them for what they really are. It's time the government arrested the ringleaders and locked them away so that the rest of the country can get back to normalcy. Sondhi is a disgrace to Thailand. The fact that he has to PAY THE PROTESTERS to be out there every day causing trouble only underlines how little support he really has. He wants change? Let him beg for it on a pedestrian overpass 50 years after he gets out of jail.
Of course, this is only the tip of the iceberg. Thailand has much deeper problems than the PAD. The whole social system is built on a very brittle foundation and when that crumbles, as it will eventually, then what will happen? My prediction is that those who have been downtrodden will rise up and put an end to the whole farce. It's about time. Ever since 1932 Thailand has been engulfed by coup after coup, uprising after uprising. Corruption is endemic. Those who work the hardest get the least reward, while the fat cats in their Mercs and Beemers, their wives dolled up with Big Hair and jewelry, continue to make billions. They obviously don't read history. All they have to do is look at France. The party is coming to an end.
Thaksin was toppled because the old gang could see he was leading the country to become a republic. THAT is what all these troubles are about.
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Nio wrote:I agree with much of what DocN said.
Thailand Lover you are very ignorant of what is happening here.
Why is the former PM and family in excile in UK with billions of Thailands money?
Why accept a government that was elected in massive fraud and vote buying, has had many MP disqualified, political parties disbanded etc.
Why do you think this current government can be fair and impartial when their only political agenda is to rewrite the constitution to allow Thaksin to return?
This country belongs to the people, not just a handful of Thaksins relatives and cronies.
The people have a moral responsibility to uprise and crush this anarchy once and for all.
Read some Thai history, Thailand-Burma etc. You have to overthrow the enemy whether foreign or domestic when your idealism and principles are compromised and there is no legal recourse or resolution.
The people have no option but to overthrow the government. There is no impartiality in this government.
Why does Thaksin still have a Thailand diplomatic passport when he is on the run?
In any other civilized country in the world, Thaksin would be brought to justice.
In in 2008, the Nazi holocaust perpetrators are still be hunted and tried for their crimes against humanity.
Thailand needs to prove once and for all that money is not above the law and principles of this country by overthrowing this anachy and trying all those convicted in the courts.
Nio, you are very misinformed. The charges against Thaksin are all politically motivated. He was leading the country to be a republic. Sure, there was some corruption, but can you really tell me that the old guard and PAD are not corrupt? They are obviously much more corrupt. They are trying to seize the country by force of arms. They are causing untold damage to the country.
If the people think Thaksin and the current government are so corrupt, why did they vote him in and continue to vote him in?
Because they are tired of being held down by the entrenched power elite. We all know who and what they are. They are the ones who have led this country down to its current state. Read some history Nio. Not just the history the school books tell you. You can only read the real history of Thailand outside the country. Why is that do you think?
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angelese wrote:Dear Khun Rahat,
If you said so, it means you don't believe in moral. But I do believe that leaders MUST have moral, otherwise power in their hands would turn to be devil, just like the situation at this moment.
Also, please EDUCATE me WHICH channels are at the PAD's side?
As you said, PAD is only a group of people with no legal power in hands, comparing to the government that CAN ORDER everything. Come on. If you are a Thai, you must have realized how distorted the news, especially in NBT channel is.
I think so far, only Thai PBS and Nation channel are the neutral ones, I have nothing to say for the rest.
I am not saying that they WANT to distort it. I am saying that the government use the media as a tool to purify themselves. It is SO obvious that Taksin's gone, yet his puppets are playing god in this country at this very moment.
I do respect the cops's duty.
But must they use bombs and fire guns? THEY REALLY USE them. I was very close to where the bomb was thrown as I was one of the medic team. The sound was significantly different of the canister. It is unacceptable that the cop blame all these to the PAD because the cops really THREW the bombs at those.
Must they shoot the medic team sent by the \\ ////? Those nurses were helping injured people and six of them were intentionally shot (they aimed the gun only at the medic team at that time).
Must they shoot the canister to the ambulance which are in a hurry to send injured people to the hospital?
Above all I know that you and me just stand at the opposite point of view. I wish the royal system will be preserved. I guess you don't. I believe that the PAD are peaceful enough (yet I agree with you at some point at NBT) so that it has not turn in to mayhem though we have been in so many confrontations.
Could you please clarify what you mean by me not believing in morals? If you understand the jurisprudential tie between LAW and MORALITY you will understand that my post is ALL about morals, buf if you want me to simplify it based also on what you said, I believe that even if there are immoral leaders (and they are in every country in the world) the RULE OF LAW will deal with them, not street gangsters and protestors. The fact that an immoral leader had to flee thailand and another one had to quit his post and now the ruling party might be dissolved illustrates my point clearly. The thai people, urban or rural, are not as naive as you think. A recent bkk post article stated that former TRT mps in the isaan area who switched to pua pandin paid TRIPLE what they used to pay, but still lost because the rural voters dont care about cash handouts, they want their children to go to school for free since they cant afford it (thaksin gave that), they want to know if their family is sick they can afford medicine (thaksin gave that), and the list goes on. Am i trying to white-wash the man? of course not! Along all these populist policies massive corruption was involved. But for the person whose son can now get an education and whose mother can finally be treated for her sickness, can you blame them for being ignorant?
As for your claim that cops threw bombs at them, I spoke with some people who were there and was told many clips showed some explosions were in fact cause by home-made explosives some of the protestors were carrying ON them, perhaps to be used if things got out of hand (ping-pong bombs or something?) Also if the police did those horrible things like prevent the nurses from working and shooting the ambulance, they must be punished. Again, through what? THE RULE OF LAW. How come you dont mention the fact that police were SHOT (if the PAD are peaceful why do they carry guns?) STABBED, and even run over by PAD supporters in a pickup truck who reveresed to try to kill the police. Should the law only apply to the police and not PAD because for some reason of which perhaps you or some other PAD supporter can explain the PAD are above the law? What about how the PAD hijacked so many busses last night to use them to block the police from getting to them? is that ok?
The news today: Khun suriyasai and PAD leaders will charge the government in local and international courts. HYPOCRITES!!! Dont forget this is coming from a man/men with ARREST WARRANTS on their heads and they REFUSE to follow the law, but now they want the law to be used against everyone else? Still, they can sue anyone they want. But, the claim that they will go to the international criminal court is silly. Thailand has not even ratified the treaty establishing it. At the international level, as of today, a state (except within EU) CANNOT be charged for abuse of power, human rights violations, etc. Like i said before the best thing is to charge the police for excessive use of force and claim damages for the injuries. At least stay within the legal system and stop trying to retaliate on the streets. Thats what gangsters do (i use that word a lot dont i?)
As for the channels, I'm not sure what you are referring to, did i mention the media in my post? anyways, i think if you watch ASTV, you should ALSO watch NBT, and if you only watch NBT, you should also watch ASTV. This way you can hear BOTH sides of the story and make your OWN informed choice about what to believe rather than getting brainwashed by both. oh and thai pbs are quite obviously pro-pad from my own experience with them! Still, the BEST thing to happen is if ALL the media, especially the ASTV who are so biased i dont want to call them 'news', stick to the middle ground and report BOTH sides of the story.
By the way, if anyone knows of a public seminar in thai or english about what happened please let fellow forummers know. There needs to be dialogue for this wonderful country we are in to move forwards.
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thaksin and his cronies may be corrupt, may abuse their power to amass untold personal fortunes, etc. but the old power elites, were they not corrupt, were they not rich too? at least, thaksin's govt had more accountability, transparency, generated wealth for the country and distributed them to the people (mainly the poor, i believe). he gave thailand a competent govt. ok, maybe a corrupt and tyranical one at that, but stil, at least a govt that at least made public its policies and had a face.
did we have this before thaksin? small wonder that most of thailand's development and money have been concentrated in a few select cities all this while. its a situation waiting to explode anyway.
i am optimistic that all this mayhem will generate more openness in the thai society and usher in a period of conciliatory peace and self-reflection for a long time to come
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When people can occupy the Parliament and incapacitate the government without any legal repercussions, that is pretty much anarchy.[/quote]
Are you serious?
The mostly peacefull blocking of public property already quallifies as a "state of lawlessness"???
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But it is how you deal with that?
"Just measure" is the expression that should be used.
Violence in any form is NOT just measure.
Carrying off...that would be a good idea! (Without grapes and wine!)
And for the PAD members being armed...
Is this REALLY the first demonstration you are seeing- on TV, for example?
Almost every demonstration in every major or minor city in Europe has some idiots, carrying weapons, and baseball bats is the least serious things among them!
NO, it is not right or justified!
But you are acting like it is the end of the world.
It happens all over the world as we speak. And it has not turned one country into a banana-republic!
You are speaking of the PAD like they are all dangerous maniacs on the loose, out to ruin ////// and country!
On the other hand you are talking of a man, who stole enough money from his people to buy a PREMIER LEAGUE football club (and sell it with a gain!!), as if he were some kind of missunderstood saint!
He is a criminal!
Just because he actually did some good things, shouldn't grant him amnesty for stealing money that could (just a random thought) buildt schools, hospitals etc.
And the current government is shielding him from justice to be brought upon him!
If you would be hiding a criminal in your hose from the law...that would make you criminal, too- right?!
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please remember the ends does not always justify the means. I believe the cause of most among the demonstrators are good, but I don't see any PAD leaders renouncing the use of violence. If any demonstrator is found to be engage in criminal acts (such as throwing bombs, or piercing policemen), they should expose them if they are serious about PEACEFUL demonstrations.
For a little of crystal gazing.....
If the rest of the Thais are living in the same planet, they will noticed that the world financial markets has been pummelled while the fight goes on between PAD and the government. The Thai economy will go down, as with most economies, and made much worse by the unrest created by the PAD.
One year from now, the ordinary Thai folks will realise, it is not Thaksin that cause them the economic hardship (since he would probably still be in UK). If a resolution has not be found by then, the silent majority may descend on the PAD like an angry mob (just like the PAD? )
Maybe this time, the PAD will cite police brutality again for not protecting the PAD against the majority fighting back.
So by careful of what you wish for....
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