Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby Suttisan on Thu May 28, 2009 2:21 pm

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Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

The director general of the Land Department has reiterated that foreigners using Thai nominees to buy land anywhere in the country will have their land title deeds revoked if caught – even if the nominee in question is a lawfully wedded spouse.

Land Department Director Anuwat Meteewiboonwut made the comments during a recent stop in Phuket as part of a nationwide inspection tour of 30 provinces.

The tour is aimed at improving public services by land officials in three areas: dress, conduct when dealing with the public and working harder to eliminate a backlog of work.

Many members of the public have complained that it takes up to a year to complete a transaction that should only take one day, he said.

Mr Anuwat, a former governor of both Phang Nga and Samut Prakan provinces, said he was satisfied on the first two points, but rated the general level of success among land officials nationwide at speeding up their work rate at “only 30%”.

The next round of inspection tours will come in July, after which time personnel changes will be considered if service does not improve, he said.

“We have to keep pressure on them, otherwise the work will not get done,” he said.

As for foreigners seeking to buy homes in Phuket, they can do so through the Condominium Act, which allows foreign ownership of up to 49% of any project, he said.

Foreigners cannot use a Thai spouse as a nominee to buy property in Thailand, however.

“If the Thai spouse has enough money to buy the house that is fine, but if the Thai has no money and uses money given to him or her by a foreigner to acquire property, that is against the law. If we check and find out later that a Thai person has been using money from a foreigner to buy land anywhere in Thailand, we will revoke title deeds,” he said.

Mr Anuwat said the provisions of [Ministry of Interior] ministerial order 43 makes it difficult to issue land documents quickly, as it requires action from a number of different agencies. Desire for land on the island has also led to encroachment problems here, he said.

As a key market for property companies, Phuket is a constant source of problems and complaints to the director general’s office, he admitted.

“We will try to resolve these problems and develop our personnel continuously in order to provide high quality services. Fortunately the governor of Phuket used to work in the Land Department, so he understands the procedures and can help co-ordinate all the agencies involved,” he said.

Mr Anuwat was speaking of Phuket Governor Wichai Phraisa-ngop, who served as Land Office director in Nakhon Pathom in 1997 and as deputy director of the Land Department nationwide in 2003.


-- Phuket Gazette 2009-05-27

If this is true it looks like me and my wife will be taking all our money away from Thailand and going back to a less prejudiced society.
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby Ian on Thu May 28, 2009 2:26 pm

Related forum topic: Farangs Barred From Buying Thai Land

please look at viewtopic.php?f=55&t=2102
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby charlie on Fri May 29, 2009 9:54 am

Expats, welcome to Phuket

Between the seizure of land and houses belonging to foreign and public flagrant denunciation according to Phuket Gazette articles, we will have to be more clever to survive in Thailand because witch-hunting game is open by these times of lean incomes.

The expats who have put their shares of ownership of houses, lands, boats or companies in Thailand in the names of their Thai spouses, Thai nominees or Thai partners (lawyers, accounting offices, friends, etc ...) will have a lot of concern if the Thai administration decides to strengthen the existing laws in favor of Thai people following complaints from unscrupulous Thai opportunist investors who would like to acquire those foreign assets without too much effort.

In Thailand, it looks like cheating and dispossessing defenseless expats before the law, is not considered as a sin by most Thais and it may become a national sport in a near future.

A concerned :twisted: expat.
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby villager on Fri May 29, 2009 10:49 am

propaganda wrote:
charlie wrote:Welcome to Phuket
In Thailand, it looks like cheating and dispossessing defenseless expats before the law, is not considered as a sin by most Thais and it may become a national sport in a near future.


The tsunami on Dec 26th 2004 was the day dispossessing defenceless Expats became the national sport.
Total lawlessness replaced what had been, up to then, a reasonably controlled situation.
The chaos created by the "Wave" and the immediate reduction in tourist numbers meant that all tourists (and Expats choosing to stay there) became fair game for Thais (including the police) living in lean times.
Nothing has changed since then, in fact it has gotten worse. Phuket today is a very dangerous place. :shock:[/ What beat,s me is with all the bad publicity Phuket has had over the last month or two ,is just why should any one in possession of their marbles, should want to live, holiday ,or run a business there!!.
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby TexasSlim on Fri May 29, 2009 11:26 am

So let's see if I got this right: Last trip down to Australia I sold up many things and brought the money back to Thailand. My plan is to use this money to pay for a house for my Thai wife and myself to live in later this year after we get legally married. As I am the one providing the money for the purchase of the house/property then we are breaking Thai law and if the authorities find out that I provided the money then they can confiscate the property deeds. Is this the situation?
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby Ian on Fri May 29, 2009 11:41 am

TexasSlim wrote:So let's see if I got this right: Last trip down to Australia I sold up many things and brought the money back to Thailand. My plan is to use this money to pay for a house for my Thai wife and myself to live in later this year after we get legally married. As I am the one providing the money for the purchase of the house/property then we are breaking Thai law and if the authorities find out that I provided the money then they can confiscate the property deeds. Is this the situation?


So you give the money to the wife's parents as SinSod. They then give the money to your wife in order to buy a house.
Basically any third party arrangement is a way to get around this rule.
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby Niceguy on Fri May 29, 2009 12:17 pm

TexasSlim wrote:So let's see if I got this right: Last trip down to Australia I sold up many things and brought the money back to Thailand. My plan is to use this money to pay for a house for my Thai wife and myself to live in later this year after we get legally married. As I am the one providing the money for the purchase of the house/property then we are breaking Thai law and if the authorities find out that I provided the money then they can confiscate the property deeds. Is this the situation?


Um... Let me try to give you a response that might help...

In my opinion, when two people get married, then the money (the man's and the woman's) become their money, not his or hers.... I'm not talking about the 'legality' of things, but just my opinion of how things should be when two people get married. Not just in Thailand, but anywhere on earth.

So if you bring your money to Thailand, and marry a Thai lady, then the money that your brought from Austrailia AND the money your wife had becomes YOUR (you and your wife) money,

Now, if you buy a house (with a plot of land) with that money, and the officials ask who's house is it,

YOU JUST SAY IT'S HERS.

Then the officials should leave it at that. I think...
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby Ian on Fri May 29, 2009 12:26 pm

Niceguy wrote:I just learned, you can't say

H, m, . . .

(which means, \\ ////... I'm thinking about what i'm going to say...)

Strange.. and funny.


Used to be one of my favorite expressions befor I joined the BP, try using Um :lol:
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby hyperinflation on Fri May 29, 2009 2:11 pm

Niceguy wrote:
TexasSlim wrote: As I am the one providing the money for the purchase of the house/property then we are breaking Thai law and if the authorities find out that I provided the money then they can confiscate the property deeds. Is this the situation?


In my opinion, when two people get married, then the money (the man's and the woman's) become their money, not his or hers.... I'm not talking about the 'legality' of things, but just my opinion of how things should be when two people get married. Not just in Thailand, but anywhere on earth.

So if you bring your money to Thailand, and marry a Thai lady, then the money that your brought from Austrailia AND the money your wife had becomes YOUR (you and your wife) money,


You are really getting into an esoteric area of Thai law, but I think your interpretation is incorrect. While this would be correct in the West, I don't believe the same applies here. Certainly, during a divorce, assets that were acquired before marriage are given back to their original owners. Only money and assets acquired during the marriage are jointly owned. Further, if you can show the money used to purchase an asset came entirely from funds acquired by 1 party before marriage, the you can legally claim 100% ownership of that asset.

So, what you need to do to protect yourself, is give your fiancee all of the money BEFORE you legally get married. Then, when you sign the paper that says the money used to buy the property was entirely hers, you have the documentation to prove it (in the form of bank statements) In that instance, you truly have no claim to the property, and there will be no concerns of her being your nominee. However, note that in the instance of a divorce, you truly have waived all of your rights to the asset by doing this. Otherwise, I have seen people successfully argue the document signed at the land office was fraudulent and therefore meaningless. I haven't actually seen this happen in court, but Thai divorce lawyers do seem to be intimidated by this threat.

I am not a lawyer, but have had several friends go through divorce proceedings here. The results can often be surprising to those of us raised in the West. Marriage does not necessarily mean what was yours is hers and vice versa.
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Re: Land purchase through Thai spouse forbidden: Land Dept

Postby pachangamac042 on Fri May 29, 2009 4:56 pm

This is just discrimination at its best. Is may wife or for an instance any other Thai person married to a foreigner, worth less than a Thai not married to a foreigner? This is just disgusting and shows me what bad folks some Thais are. They are not just bad against foreigners but even against their own people.

We have been in the process of looking for a nice location to buy or built our own house in Thailand. I guess that we do not need to search anymore. We will just buy our home in Spain, where foreigners are treated a little better then in Thailand.

After some 20 years Thailand experience, I guess, that I am having enough of them. I feel sorry for my wife and her family, as they are great people, but some Thai authorities are worth less then ….

I really wish, that Thais would be treated in the rest of the world the way they treat us in Thailand. Well, no, I do not really wish it, as it would not make any difference.

It is time that we do not call Thailand, the land of smiles anymore, but the land of foreigners haters. As a response to all things making our lives miserable in Thailand, maybe we should just move out and on.

Imagine all foreigners leaving that country. Not only expats, but foreign companies and NGOs as well. Imagine not sending any more tourists to that foreigner unfriendly country. Imagine not doing anymore business with them.

Maybe, and only maybe, some Thais would realize then how bad they are and how bad they have been threatening us. Of course would the Thais who less deserve it suffer the most, but it would hurt those rich policy making elite as well. Could that change something? Maybe it is really time for a revolution in Thailand. Maybe it is really time to decapitated some elite and other rulers.

No idea where Thailand is going, but I have the feeling that it will never get there.
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